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      Proper Problem Reporting for the TFDi Design 717   07/09/2017

      Folks, As the user count is increasing, it is becoming more of a task for us to stay on top of problem reports. We are also receiving an increasing amount of incomplete reports that we are unable to follow up on (which frustrates everyone, us included). On that note, we are going to be enforcing a stricter formal problem reporting system. There are a few main points that need to be addressed. ALL problem reports must be submitted via the Bugs and Suggestions system. Open discussion on the forums is fine, but our team simply cannot respond to every single comment (especially when the majority of doing so is asking for information the Bugs and Suggestions system already asks for). Incomplete reports will be ignored. This means reports like "my FPS is bad" will not be given weight. This isn't because we don't care. It is because a report like that does absolutely nothing for anyone - we can't fix it based on that. Please include EVERYTHING you can possibly think of regarding the problem and take as many steps as you can to isolate it. Prepar3D v4, despite what you have heard, can still be unstable. Yes, it is definitely possible to fly flights without issues. But it is still relatively new, as are most of the addons available for it. Please refrain from attacking us or other developers because of this. We have already had one scenario where a 717 CTD was resolved by an update to Prepar3D itself. This is likely not the only time that will be the case. You are still free to report the crashes, as it may help whoever the developers of the faulting code are solve the issue. Duplicate reports will be deleted/merged. For the sake of sanity for us trying to prioritize and evaluate issues, if we discover multiple reports of the same thing, we may merge/delete the duplicates. We strongly encourage you to search and see if your problem has been reported before. Thank you all in advance. This may seem overbearing, but this is the only way we are going to be able to stay on top and continue heading in the direction we, and the community, want.
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flyforever

Can we get our heads around this fps fluctuation?

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The tfdi 717 is the only aircraft that, when parked, with all systems on, creates a wild fps swing. On my system, no matter what scenery complexity setting, the frame rates will fluctuate between 17 and 30. Not much changes when I am flying, but clearly something must be going on. On my system, i5-2500k @4.4 and a gtx 1060 6 gig , this should not be happening.

When I look at cpu and processes, I see fsx taking up must of the cpu and then the sql server. This sql server is turned on by the 717.

I can accept steady low frame rates, but this extreme fluctuation is driving me crazy.

tony

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Novej   

How's your jets fluidity?  I have learned that the fps monitor in FSX (Don't know about P3d) is more a secondary monitor than primary, at least for Weaksauce (aka my AMD processor).  I look more for overall stability and smoothness.  In at least my case though the CPU can't pump out 40-50 fps numbers I can get an acceptably smooth simulation with fps as low as 10 on the ground at various payware airports with traffic.  And she usually will start jumping all over the place between 15-35 in the air.  (Recently I've seen a 43 spike a few times LOL)  Considering the hardware I have and the resources the addons these days need, and the amount of additional programs I have running...Im ok with that......Or I should say I was.  I'm finally upgrading as I fear the upcoming A330, 787 and 747 may finally bring my cpu to her knees........and I want better than just "acceptable!"

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Let me chime in here, since I have the same problem (i5 3570K@4.2, GTX670 2GB, 16GB CL9 RAM, all SSD, Win7 64bit, P3Dv3.3)

The fluidity is horrrible, seriously, with those fluctuating fps, the 717 is actually unflyable, at least not enjoyable at all. 

And it doesn't matter if HW rendering is set to on or off, with it on, the fluctuating might be a little worse, with it off, the stuttering is very strong. 

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foobar   

Really? You are using SQL server from MS? What is a terrible choice... Admittedly it's a better choice than all that sim's devs who are using plain text files without any indexes... But sqlite is not a good compromise?

Edited by foobar

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foobar   

But I really think the fps issue is due to a bad coding practice. To use as much cpu resource it's look like some infinite-while-true loops without any micro seconds of sleeping time...

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odourboy   

@foobar - If this were true, I expect we'd all be seeing issues and I for one (W7, P3D V3.4.9, i5-3570@4.3, GTX980, 4K) am experiencing smooth FPS and good performance (by comparison, a little better FPS and VAS than NGX). Further, H/W rendering works very well on my system because I've tailored my setup to keep my GPU well below 100% utilization.

There are a huge number of variables (OS, H/W, sim version, add-ons, settings....) to contend with so these types of issues are virtually inevitable for any developer who tries to push the design envelope even a bit. I feel for those struggling with this A/C, but I don't blame TFDi to pushing out the product prematurely. It's simply impossible to test for every permutation and combination that will be encountered upon release.

EDIT: I suggest an experiment which may help get a handle on this issue: Set up a monitor for your GPU (NI or Process Exporer have this capability) and configure your settings (turn off SGSS filtering in your NI profile, turn down graphics rendering options..) to ensure your GPU utilization has lots of headroom (say 30% or 40%) and is relatively consistent. Then turn on the 717 addon manager hardware rendering option (for my system, this increased my GPU utilization by about 13%.. from about 53% to 66%) and see how the 717 performs. Not a solution, but I am curious if offloading your CPU to a GPU with ample headroom makes a difference to those struggling.

Edited by odourboy

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It's important to distinguish between platforms, and I wish the developers would separate the forums according to the two or possibly three platforms: FSX, FSX-SE, and P3D.

A lot of time and confusion can be reduced by making sure that users provide as much information as possible.

If other aircrafts didn't run smoothly, I would definitely look at my setup. But so far, the 717 is the only plane that taxes my system beyond reasonable expectations.

I repeat, this is on FSX acceleration with no add ons and an I5-2500k at 4.4 ghz and a gtx 1060.

 

 

tony

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foobar   

Monitoring only the cu does not make any sense.
Have also a look on the process queue, it's useful... eg cpu 100% with a litlle queue is perfect but 100% with a huge queue of delayed operations (that is 717 case) is terrible... You can observe both meters with perfmon.exe.

Edited by foobar

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foobar   
29 minutes ago, LSwistar said:

Even with 1.05.0 fps fluctuating extreme strong.14-40 fps

Same here 18-60. 
I'm pretty sure it's a coding issue but I'm giving up, just ordered a Intel Core i7-7700K with a Gigabyte Aorus GA-Z270X-GAMING K5 motherboard...

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